9mm any favs?

topic posted Sun, April 3, 2005 - 11:30 PM by  Amy
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I'm looking into getting a new 9mm. I was wondering if any of you ladies have any favs. I have very small hands. i want one for personal defense. I already have a 22. So far the top of my list is the Sig 239 But I was also looking at maybe testing out the HK P2000. Any others I should look into?

Also what do you really think 9mm or 40 for stopping power. And how easy is it to load your own amo?

-thanks
amy
posted by:
Amy
offline Amy
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  • Re: 9mm any favs?

    Mon, April 4, 2005 - 9:26 AM
    I am all about 9mm. I prefer it to any other handgun calibre.

    My favourite 2 smaller 9mms are
    S&W model 6904- my concealed carry piece. small, easy to shoot, PITA to clean.
    Glock 19C- small gripframe, low recoil

    reloading is not really all that cost effective on 9mm when you can buy reloads at 120 bucks per thousand...
    • Re: 9mm any favs?

      Mon, April 4, 2005 - 9:41 AM
      As far as stopping power goes the .40
      is far superior to the 9mm

      I have a Sig in .40 239
      a very nice weapon

      Glock does make a very light
      reasonably sized 9mm
      less pricey than the Sig too
      • Re: 9mm any favs?

        Mon, April 4, 2005 - 9:57 AM
        I personally find .40s jump around a lot, making it harder to get back on target. I also think that most of the commercially available loads are too hot and overpenetrate. I have a Glock 23 in .40. It spends 99% of it's time in storage.

        But i am very biased towards 9mm, so take everything i say with a grain of salt...
  • Unsu...
     

    Re: 9mm any favs?

    Mon, April 4, 2005 - 9:49 AM
    Heya Amy-

    Have you handled a Glock yet?
    Is the glock gripstock too porky for your hands?
    There's almost no way to screw a glock up and as far as self defense goes, there's no external safety on a glock either, very simple -- just a trigger.
    I know you like pretty metal things, and I'm all for them too. You've seen my guns. For this application though, if that plastic fantastic fits your hands I'd strongly recommend you conslder it.

    Also, you can get into a frontsite course for about two hundred fifty bucks.
    Get scheduled. Training is what'll save you life if the shit hits the fan.

    --John

    • Unsu...
       

      Re: 9mm any favs?

      Mon, April 4, 2005 - 10:05 AM
      Oh -- about ammo


      I'm set up to reload anything from the tiny little hornet out to 450no2 3-1/2" Nitro Express.
      Loading your own means having a bunch of tools and at least a bench space for the job.
      My recommendation to you - get a 1000 round flat of ammo at a good deal somewhere when it's on sale. Save your brass if you want, some time or another someone with the right loading dies will let you saddle up at their bench so you can get a feel for it.
      There's money to save reloading, but the initial investment might be more than you want to deal with.

      And I'd say take the .40 if you can handle it.
      Jackson arms likely has some modle of pistol in the rental fleet that they keep in 9 and .40 for you to compare.


      --John
      • Unsu...
         

        Re: 9mm any favs?

        Mon, April 4, 2005 - 10:51 AM

        yeah, and Monday night is ladies night at Jackson Arms- 1/2 price!!

        let's go!
        • Re: 9mm any favs?

          Mon, April 4, 2005 - 1:43 PM
          i poked aroung thehighroad a little, and although the .40 is has better stopping power, as stated, it will jump more, and hitting your target is more important.
          also, use hollow points.
          the other problem with .40 is you stand a good chance of going thru lots of stuff you don't want to.
          • Unsu...
             

            couple notes here...

            Mon, April 4, 2005 - 5:15 PM
            First about muzzle jump--
            That muzzle is gonna rise after the bullet leaves the muzzle.
            Sight alignment, trigger control, and shot placement are everything.
            The .40 has far greater one hit stop success history.

            About overpenetration--
            The 9mm is notorious for overpenetration.
            9mm ammo relies on high velocity to do it's deed, and it's known to overpenetrate more -far more- than the .40s&w

            Hollowpoints good.
            Definitely agree there, for personal defense, the hollowpoint is more often than not going to be the best choice.

            The .40 can (and is via factory loads) be loaded with light weight, deep hollowpoint jacketed bullets that are designed to have light recoil and little muzzle flash. Being bigger in diameter, they put more shock -and foot/pounds of force- into the target and have a harder time zipping through multiple targets.



            --John
            • Re: couple notes here...

              Mon, April 4, 2005 - 5:32 PM
              "The 9mm is notorious for overpenetration.
              9mm ammo relies on high velocity to do it's deed, and it's known to overpenetrate more -far more- than the .40s&w "

              duh. that is actually what i read too, the 9mm moves fast, i got it wrong.
              • Re: couple notes here...

                Tue, April 5, 2005 - 8:59 AM
                I don't understand where this opinion comes from. The reason the FBI switched to .40S&W is to improve penetration, and the likeliness of a wound that will prevent the target from being a threat.

                www.firearmstactical.com/ammo_...ta.htm gives a rundown of many ammo types, their penetration into gelatin, and their velocity.

                The bottom line for me is that a .40s&w sends a 165-185 grain bullet at 1000-1200 fps, and a 9x19 sends a 115-147 grain bullet at 900-1300 fps.

                I'll go for the smaller bullet. I load with hydrashock tacticals which are a 147 grain bullet at 950fps with nice expansion characteristics.
                • Re: couple notes here...

                  Tue, April 5, 2005 - 12:45 PM
                  the 9mm's reputation for over penetrating as well as low stopping power have to do with the fact that police agencies made it policy to only allow their officers to use ball ammo (FMJ bullets) for many years. these were justified as most depts. were inexperienced with automatics and wanted 100% feeding reliability. many early automatic pistols (especially out of the box) exhibited difficulty feeding anything other than military ball type ammo. most of the modern 9mm's no longer have failure to feed issues with ammunition types such as the hollow point.

                  the military ball round doesn't deform when it enters soft tissue per it's velocity and tended to just go in and out of it's intended victim with as little trauma (i.e. energy transfer) as possible.

                  a larger and slower moving round in FMJ (eg. the 45 ACP with it's reputation as a fight stopper) was always looked up to as it transfered more of it's energy into soft tissue and tended not to exit the victim.

                  if you use a hollow point or pre-fragmented (ex: frangible) bullet in 9mm it transfers more of it's energy into the subject therefore becoming more of a fight stopper.

                  sorry if this is too wordy or off subject.
                • Re: couple notes here...

                  Wed, April 27, 2005 - 10:46 AM
                  "I don't understand where this opinion comes from. The reason the FBI switched to .40S&W is to improve penetration, and the likeliness of a wound that will prevent the target from being a threat."

                  I think the FBI is required to use FMJ bullets as opposed to hollowpoints so yeah penetration will likely be better with that ammo.

                  But I could be wrong : ).

                  Sasquatch
            • Re: couple notes here...

              Mon, April 4, 2005 - 7:58 PM
              what about silver tips to slow it down?

              I'm going to try a 40 and a 9 to see which one I like better. Then get into bullets. afterall hitting my target when I'm startled out of my mind is hard enough to do.

              the sig 239 felt right in my hand but I haven't fired one yet.
              • Unsu...
                 

                Re: couple notes here...

                Mon, April 4, 2005 - 9:25 PM
                Silver tips might just be the ticket.
                Something like that with a deep split hollow point, so you'll get good bearing surface on the riflling for the lighter bullet weight.

                For each gun, there's gonna be some ammo that works or groups better than others.
                Once you get the feel for what you're looking at, go with the most gun you can handle comfortably, then figure out what's going to perform reliably and maximize the terminal performance of the cartridge out of your particular gun, whatever barrel length you end up getting.

                Do consider the action type too.
                There's primarily single and double action.
                My 1911 45s are single action guns, the 9mm ruger you've used in the past is a double action gun.
                The trigger only needs to move a teensy little bit on the single action gun, but it needs to be cocked first manually for the first shot.
                A double action gun will cock that hammer for you on the first shot, and the trigger pull will be longer and in most cases take more pressure to do it.
                Some guns are capable of both. Make sure you know what the thing feels like in your hands, pulling the trigger before you choose.
                That's gonna have a lot to do with how the gun fits you.
                There might be a double action auto out there that fits nicely in your hand, but the fit goes all to hell as you stroke the trigger through it's long travel.
                Definitely something to think about.
                The Para Ordinance LDA and the Glock have triggers that are truly unique in feel and function. Both are very good too and deserve a look. Especially with your little hands.

                Once you have settled on someting, let us know. Get it out and shoot it some first to get a feel for it, my best advice to you still is to get out to frontsite and do a two day course with it.

                Then we can get together here in the bay area with a fuckload of different brands and models of cartridges at a range and do accuracy and chronograph testing to select the best thing for you and your gun.
                That'll be most important if you choose the 9mm. Gotta get the most outta that thing, chrono data and targets will be a good place to figure out what's what with different ammo.


                --John
                • Re: couple notes here...

                  Mon, April 4, 2005 - 11:12 PM
                  Here's a great self defense load for you're 9...

                  Glaser Safety Slugs are very potent and were designed to not over penetrate.

                  P.S. whatever you get, get it in a SIG

                  • This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.

                    Re: couple notes here...

                    Wed, April 6, 2005 - 9:11 AM
                    A friend just got a pimped out colt match .45.

                    I haven't shot my 9s in a while.

                    Who else is in for monday evening at Jackson Arms?
                    • Unsu...
                       

                      Re: couple notes here...

                      Wed, April 6, 2005 - 1:30 PM
                      I might be persuaded.
                      Wonder if they'll allow the 500 there, you know if half inch magnums are ok there?

                      The k-22 would be nice to get out though.



                      I love the .45
                      I've probabally shot more .45 than .22
                      The highest 'neato factor' pistol I ever shot was a .38 super that belonged to someone I'd competed against.
                      He handed it over to me to take for a spin around the course one morning. Sooo cool. It was tuned so damn well, holosight and all of that crap, the trigger was really nice, probabally a pound and a half. Total race gun. I could keep an iron target in the sight and nail it four times as it was going down into the dirt. Such a nice little hotrod 1911



                      --John
  • Re: 9mm any favs?

    Wed, April 13, 2005 - 8:15 AM
    IMHO pass on the 9 and go for the Colt Mustang .380. Should gfit well in your hand and has good stopping power. Excellent backup/boot weapon.
    • Re: 9mm any favs?

      Wed, April 13, 2005 - 2:35 PM
      Nice weapon, Mike. I have one in the Pocketlight configuration... and it's very easy as a carry weapon. Silvertip .380s are a great round for that caliber, too.
      • Re: 9mm any favs?

        Wed, April 20, 2005 - 8:37 PM
        "Pocketlight"

        My preference, thanks....I'll try the silvertips. Got hollowpoints now.
        • Re: 9mm any favs?

          Fri, April 22, 2005 - 3:55 PM
          i bought it years ago from a friend that suddenly decided it'd be better to have a revolver over an auto.

          remember those days?

          yeah, i know i'm showing my age...
    • Re: 9mm any favs?

      Wed, April 27, 2005 - 5:01 PM
      I love 9mm. Have a Glock and a Browning and much prefer the Glock. Check out the Glock 19, or the 26 if you have small hands. I have the 26. It's tiny, can be flinchy, but you can get grip extenders for the magazine which help quite a bit.
  • Re: 9mm any favs?

    Thu, April 28, 2005 - 11:23 AM
    Browning High power. Espcially if you can find an older used one in good condition made in belgium. Fine piece of craftsmanship. Be advised will cost you a piece of cash.
    • Re: 9mm any favs?

      Thu, April 28, 2005 - 4:18 PM
      I have to agree. I used to have a belgium made browning hi power. It was so reliable, easy to clean and care for, and aesthetically pleasing. I plan on replacing it with another.

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